Speedskater 167 Posted August 4, 2010 Hey you guys I decided to make a Multiplayer strategy topic for anyone interested in new builds and tactics. Feel free to ask any questions! even if it's beating a comp on easy, or dealing with teammates who decide to go cannons for first 7 minutes...with 8 probes. I'll start. So I primarily play as toss and the only build I do is the four gate and if the game still goes on get Colossus and some high temps which is successful for early pushes and some harassment but I don't know when to expan...ever so any suggestions? Also I'd like to know more build orders any suggestions? Share this post Link to post
GhoztMan 219 Posted August 4, 2010 Depending on how your initial push goes, you should do the following: 1. If your push is completely successful and you blow away most of his army, make a pylon near his base and make 2 more gateways (into warpgates) to continue the siege. 2. If your push is moderatly successful, (You kill a lot of units, but you have to retreat because he's still producing many units), then expand immediately and add on 4 more warpgates once you have your expansion saturated. (Go to step 1, minus the two more gateways). 3. If your push fails, return to base and turtle up. Build up your forces then use that army to secure your natural. (Go to step 2) As for build orders, another popular build is 2gate (usually 3gate) robo, and can be described in detail at the following video: Another build that's not as common, but still quite useful is NonY's Pheonix build, as described in this video: I'll list some other Protoss builds I use here (Besides 4gate and 2gate robo): Zealot Rush: 9 Pylon 9 Probe 9 2x Gateways 10 probe 10 pylon 11 Use Nexus Chrono Boost on Gateway, produce a zealot 12 probe 12 produce 2x zealot, chrono boosted 13 produce pylon and zealots; rush when you have 6-7 PLEASE NOTE: This build is all in. If your initial push fails, it's basically game over unless you can transition into 4gate. Basic Tech Opener: 9 pylon 13 pylon 13 gateway 15 pylon 17 produce zealot 17 2nd gateway 17 cyber core 21 forge 21 assimilator 21 pylon (Transition into an immortal or collosi build) High Econ Opener: (Assumes constant chronoboosted probes) 9 pylon 12 gateway 14 assimilator 16 pylon 16 zealot (If against Zerg or Protoss, if against Terran skip zealot) 18 cybercore (transition into 4gate or high tech build) Void Ray Rush (Not as effective as it used to be; all in build, see note) 9 pylon 11 gateway 13 assimilator 13 cyber core 13 stargate 13 produce void rays 15 2nd stargate 15 2nd assimilator 17 continue to produce VR on both stargates, push with 4-5 (Note: I usually make a forge around 11 as well, a canon or two shall hold you over till you push, but only do so if you spot an early push from the enemy) ALSO: Scouting is completely nescessary for all these builds. If you see something that directly counters your build, transition into another if possible. Handy Guides: Picking a Race Basic Rules to Live By Dictionary of Terms Build Orders What You Might Not Know Fundamentals of Macro Novice Guide to Micro and Macro Please Note: All of these are available on the StarCraft II Official Forums; I will update this list as I find more guides. Only the best and highest rated will be posted. Share this post Link to post
Speedskater 167 Posted August 4, 2010 Hmm okay thanks the 2 or 3 gate build with colossus or immortals and the high economy build sounds helpful. and yeah nony's build is epic and I love messing around with the phoenix I'm not a fan of it. Share this post Link to post
Magical_Trever 60 Posted August 5, 2010 I might upload a replay of my Tank rush strategy. Share this post Link to post
Speedskater 167 Posted August 5, 2010 Feel free to do so since you do have a youtube account, maybe put Ghoztcraft somewhere in the video as well. Share this post Link to post
GhoztMan 219 Posted August 5, 2010 What the hell are you talking about..? It's much less efficient using your mouse compared to the hotkeys. There are hotkeys for almost every action in the game, like in SC1. Do you even have the game? Share this post Link to post
Magical_Trever 60 Posted August 5, 2010 I should have my video up within the hour. EDIT: Share this post Link to post
GhoztMan 219 Posted August 5, 2010 I should have my video up within the hour. EDIT: [VIDEO] Fairly common strategy, although usually you should pump pure marines and save your gas for more tanks. You should post up the exact BO because this was far from executed perfectly and your macro was lacking. (No offense intended ) While this is a useful strategy, that toss could've actually broken it if he had chrono'd his immortal and micro'd his stalkers closer to the tanks.The ensuing splash damage would've killed your small MM ball and he could've just sniped the tanks. Either way, this is a viable strategy, although you should usually wait until you have 2 tanks, and a bit more rines. Share this post Link to post
Magical_Trever 60 Posted August 5, 2010 I should have my video up within the hour. EDIT: [VIDEO] Fairly common strategy, although usually you should pump pure marines and save your gas for more tanks. You should post up the exact BO because this was far from executed perfectly and your macro was lacking. (No offense intended ) While this is a useful strategy, that toss could've actually broken it if he had chrono'd his immortal and micro'd his stalkers closer to the tanks.The ensuing splash damage would've killed your small MM ball and he could've just sniped the tanks. Either way, this is a viable strategy, although you should usually wait until you have 2 tanks, and a bit more rines. Yeah I should wait longer so he can get more stalkers and possibly a Immortal or two. I didn't macro much because I was distracted at the time. I use this strat nearly every time against a Protoss or Terran and it works very well. Share this post Link to post
GhoztMan 219 Posted August 5, 2010 I should have my video up within the hour. EDIT: [VIDEO] Fairly common strategy, although usually you should pump pure marines and save your gas for more tanks. You should post up the exact BO because this was far from executed perfectly and your macro was lacking. (No offense intended ) While this is a useful strategy, that toss could've actually broken it if he had chrono'd his immortal and micro'd his stalkers closer to the tanks.The ensuing splash damage would've killed your small MM ball and he could've just sniped the tanks. Either way, this is a viable strategy, although you should usually wait until you have 2 tanks, and a bit more rines. Yeah I should wait longer so he can get more stalkers and possibly a Immortal or two. I didn't macro much because I was distracted at the time. I use this strat nearly every time against a Protoss or Terran and it works very well. Actually, if you had skipped the marauder you probably could've had a second tank out and still push out at the same-ish time. Also, even when you were pushing the Protoss could've Chronoboosted his immortal, since it was no doubt about half way finished (I saw the ob pass over you). Distraction is no excuse for poor macro, imho; you should be constantly checking back at your base and using hotkeys to continually produce units. But don't take it pesonally, because I'm just criticizing the build itself, and the tendencies which a lot of players have. I don't know what league your in but in higher leagues this strategy isn't used as much as in Silver/Gold/Low Platinum when it is used it's pretty easy to counter if scouted. I'm not bagging on you personally, just the fact that good macro could improve builds like this a lot, and that the more you use it the more people will know how to counter it. This is a very common build, and sometimes even used in the higher leagues (See Masq vs IdrA, Game 1) and it's considered cheese by some people. The only thing wrong with cheese is that it's used a lot, and when a build is used a lot, it get's easier and easier to counter it. If you use this nearly every time against Toss and Terran, then perhaps you should look into some more builds once it starts to lose it's effectiveness. Share this post Link to post
Speedskater 167 Posted August 5, 2010 I need to improve on my macro helps ending games faster with those very much needed higher teir units or more gateways for a constant attack Any Zerg builds I hate toss toss vs Share this post Link to post
Magical_Trever 60 Posted August 6, 2010 You just had to be that know it all didn't you Ghoztman. Share this post Link to post
Speedskater 167 Posted August 6, 2010 Ha it helps especially when you suck Share this post Link to post
GhoztMan 219 Posted August 6, 2010 You just had to be that know it all didn't you Ghoztman. T.T Guess that's what happens when you immerse yourself in the metagame. Share this post Link to post
Magical_Trever 60 Posted August 7, 2010 If your so pro, Ghoztman, why don't you make a video? Share this post Link to post
GhoztMan 219 Posted August 7, 2010 Nowhere have I claimed to be "So Pro". (At least I think so o.o) I'm a high ranking Platinum (Top 10) but by no means does that mean I'm pro. I not even THAT good, I'm just knowledgeable on unit counters, the metagame, and all the statistical sort of stuff. Besides, what do you want me to make a video OF? If I wanted to make a video of build orders, I would, but to be honest there are tons of other shoutcasters out there that are so much better than me, and they've already made handsome videos about common build orders. No point in making duplicates that are worse. Share this post Link to post
Magical_Trever 60 Posted August 7, 2010 Touche. But it isn't impossible to come up with something original. There is no wrong or right build order. Share this post Link to post
GhoztMan 219 Posted August 7, 2010 Oh, I'm not saying I haven't made anything original. I've created quite a few experimental build that work quite well, but I'm too lazy/never seem to get around to making VODs of them.. I suppose if it's requested, I can. Share this post Link to post
GhoztMan 219 Posted August 7, 2010 Protoss Strategy: Basic Openers and Tactics The link above is to a forum topic that fleshes out all the builds (and more?) I explained above, in greater detail and probably better timed BO's. Definitely check it out if your a starting Protoss. Share this post Link to post
Speedskater 167 Posted August 7, 2010 Oh thanks ghoztman I appreciate it. Trev your a terran player right? any common builds youd like to share Share this post Link to post
Magical_Trever 60 Posted August 8, 2010 I've got lots of builds, but I don't feel like sharing them. Share this post Link to post
ZeroFrost 0 Posted August 8, 2010 Zergling rush ( Yes Speed IS CRUCIAL) Drones until 10 10 - Extractor (put three Drones on when it finishes) 9 - Drone 10 - Spawning Pool 9 - Overlord 10 - Drone (use him to scout) 11, 12 - Drones 13 - Zergling Speed upgrade (the Pool should finish around now, and this upgrade is CRUCIAL to the rush) 13 - Queen 14, 15, 16 - Zerglings 16 - Overlord This is the build order I most commonly use. Its purpose is to put the Zerg player at an economic advantage early on. 9 - Overlord 10 - Drone (scout) 15 - Spawning Pool 16 - Drone (rally him to your natural expansion, and build a Hatchery when you can afford it) 16 - Extractor 17 - Hatchery (^^ this Drone) 17 - Overlord After this phase into what ever you do for your midgame. ( counter what ever you've scouted so far. ) Credits to whoever started these kinds of builds. Share this post Link to post
Magical_Trever 60 Posted August 8, 2010 I'm going to start playing some Zerg. Simply because they are so cheese. EDIT: I think I am better off with Terran Share this post Link to post
ZeroFrost 0 Posted August 8, 2010 I'm going to start playing some Zerg. Simply because they are so cheese. EDIT: I think I am better off with Terran By cheese I assume you mean equal to Terran and Protoss? If so I agree. Share this post Link to post